[brightbelt]

Hi, I'm glad I found this. I Think newcomers could benifit from a basic commands tutorial for THIS distro. It could include information such as:
1) what the root command is for This Distro;
2) The basic command to install a program for this
distro; basic one to uninstall etc
3) How directories are done to reference file locations, like:
'cd Desktop';
4) How to access & use the Synaptic Package Manager, with helpful tips on critical downloads that are available there, like certain graphics drivers etc.
5) Xserver crashing remedies - given in detail, step by step, so a Newbie can understand it.

This might be a start; is there anything wrong with the way things are now?
Generally newcomers are given links, which lead to a wealth of lists and information that covers all distros & lays out way too much information for any newbie to take in in the beginning.

Plus much of the information has little to do with where you are at because of differences in Distros.

I will say, the way you all have these forums defined is superb-the best by far I've seen. There's a lot of quality here, which is why I care enough to want to help make things better.

I hope my suggestions are relevant and helpful. If I've suggested things already here that I missed, my apologies.
Many Thanks, Frank B.

[vampirefo1]

5. http://pclosmag.com/html/Issues/200805/page04.html

[brightbelt]

Nice work Vampirefo1, and here's my point exactly. Please pardon me while I play devil's advocate:

#1 - "As root" is not defined here. A beginner would not know how to sign in "as root" or maybe even what "as root' means. The writer assumes the reader knows what it is. Also, if a beginner were coming from another distro, the root command might be different, and he/she might not know what it is.

#2 - "Save it in '/'" is probably beyond any beginner's comprehension. I'm no expert either, so I'll swallow my pride and ask right now: Does it mean saving it in my home folder?

#3 -"you just get a command login" How? For a beginner this is very vague. Even from my point of view, I could ask: Are we booting with the CD in safe mode? How exactly are we getting to the command login?

So I'm sure you can see I'm no expert either. I've been with Linux for only 1.5 years max and there are still many times I get stuck following directions because the writer assumes so many things.

Believe me, I've bookmarked this howto and will use it; it's a very good one. I just think we need to be clear about the fact the a beginner really knows nothing. Nothing.

And maybe with more tutorials like yours and those we can improve upon, we can decrease the amount of confusion a beginner feels.

Many Thanks,
Frank B.

[azziam]

Nice work Vampirefo1, and here's my point exactly. Please pardon me while I play devil's advocate:

#1 - "As root" is not defined here. A beginner would not know how to sign in "as root" or maybe even what "as root' means. The writer assumes the reader knows what it is. Also, if a beginner were coming from another distro, the root command might be different, and he/she might not know what it is.

#2 - "Save it in '/'" is probably beyond any beginner's comprehension. I'm no expert either, so I'll swallow my pride and ask right now: Does it mean saving it in my home folder?

#3 -"you just get a command login" How? For a beginner this is very vague. Even from my point of view, I could ask: Are we booting with the CD in safe mode? How exactly are we getting to the command login?

So I'm sure you can see I'm no expert either. I've been with Linux for only 1.5 years max and there are still many times I get stuck following directions because the writer assumes so many things.

Believe me, I've bookmarked this howto and will use it; it's a very good one. I just think we need to be clear about the fact the a beginner really knows nothing. Nothing.

And maybe with more tutorials like yours and those we can improve upon, we can decrease the amount of confusion a beginner feels.

Many Thanks,
Frank B.

I'll agree on one hand and disagree on the other. How's that for diplomacy? I agree that clear, simple, and accurate tutorials are the most valuable on-ramp for the beginners. Every newcomer should read the category for remastering tips, tricks and how-to's or however it's worded. There's always room for taking a look at that and adding some stuff like you're talking about. OTOH, there is a wealth of info already spelled out in these forums and one of the first pieces of advice to newbies is always "Use the search function" because likely their question will be answered. Since comments have been made about how friendly this forum and this OS itself is, I agree we should all do what it takes to keep it that way. That is, be friendly and helpful. I think you're request for more entry level tutorials could be easily covered with a few more entries to the forums FAQ. Still, there is no substitute for links to more in depth reading material on Linux. One of the things I like about this distro is that it is "real Linux". The knowledge you grow learning this one, you can take to the bank, so to speak (I wish I had other stuff to take to the bank but, oh well, I am getting enriched <g>). I still recommend tuxfiles.org for beginner tutes because they are arranged in pages that are like 5-10 minute reads and also probably handy to print out if one were so inclined. I can't think of any commands I've found in my reading that haven't worked when I tried them at a prompt (I'm not talking about sudo <g>). Typing up your own list of commands, reminders, network info, etc. and keeping it handy is probably some of the easiest and best homework to do. If a beginner does this they won't need to look at it much!

[sarcastic_bastard]

brightbelt, you make good points. Too much is assumed at times. I try explaining things with the complete novice in mind, but then that still leaves assumptions that they understand some things at times I suppose. If you look in the How To's section, you'll see several tutorials/aids by myself, and I've tried breaking things down as plainly as I can, and can only assume that if one does not follow what is meant, that they will ask. I am only too happy to assist newcomers or others, but I can only make assumptions about their knowledge level if no-one says otherwise.

If anyone can suggest a topic for a possible tutorial, I am only too happy (if I am up to the task) to sit down and try and build one as plainly and concisely as possible.

[vampirefo1]

/ is the root directory. every directory in Linux must start from root.

[azziam]

/ is the root directory. every directory in Linux must start from root.

And for beginners it is important to learn that the root directory "/" is not the same as the directory /root! (I learned this just days ago and realized after reading it that I certainly needed to get past that confusing point.

[vampirefo1]

/ is root

/root is the home directory for the root user.

[sarcastic_bastard]

/ is root

/root is the home directory for the root user.

uhhh, /home/username is the home directory for user.

[vampirefo1]

/ is root

/root is the home directory for the root user.

uhhh, /home/username is the home directory for user.

maybe this will help you.

http://www.techcuriosity.com/resources/ ... ectory.php

[sarcastic_bastard]

My bad, I only read "home directory" and "user", somehow missed "root". Meh, teach me to not reread something.

[azziam]

My bad, I only read "home directory" and "user", somehow missed "root". Meh, teach me to not reread something.

Well even the author of that article made an error by leaving a space between / and "home" in his openeing paragraph We all make 'em but if we leave them uncorrected it can play hell with the new users learning process. It might be worth repeating the obvious. All usernames are included in /home such as /home/username but the superuser or root as the name implies is at the top level directly under / The list of Linux directories in that article may be helpful but I think the structure is easier to grasp just by looking in nautilus at the tiers of directories from / down and getting a sense of what is kept where. Also the fact that every little command is a program that has a home somewhere in the directory structure is something for newcomers to realize. Enough from this newb for now...

[brightbelt]

I appreciate all your feedback. I guess what got me thinking about this stuff is that I'm still new enough to Linux to where I can actually remember those facts that were invaluable to me as a beginner.

For instance, I remember specifically that these 3 facts were pivotal for me in learning how to install Linux for the first time:
1) One must format the drive for Linux as 'Ext3'
2) Mount point for the Linux install is '/' (I DO know that, my above question notwithstanding)
3) A Swap partition of 1-2 GB is required for dual boots.

Many very helpful folks who lend their time to help beginners somehow manage to forget to mention these facts.

I know it's not intentional, and my comments are in no way my reflection of these forums. These forums are friendly, responsive and helpful.

I'm just wanting to shed some light, hopefully for the beginners sake.

I'm too tired - bed time, I appreciate all the feedback,...
Many Thanks, Frank B.

[azziam]

I appreciate all your feedback. I guess what got me thinking about this stuff is that I'm still new enough to Linux to where I can actually remember those facts that were invaluable to me as a beginner.

That's pretty much how I look at it too.

For instance, I remember specifically that these 3 facts were pivotal for me in learning how to install Linux for the first time:
1) One must format the drive for Linux as 'Ext3'
2) Mount point for the Linux install is '/' (I DO know that, my above question notwithstanding)
3) A Swap partition of 1-2 GB is required for dual boots.

A swap partition of double your RAM size and up to 2GB is generally what I see recommended, dual boot is irrelevant. Also, if you have more than one Linux on your system, they'll use the same swap file or you can have more than one swap file scattered around. If you monitor the usage of your RAM and Swap, you probably won't be worried that they'll ever get maxed out.

Many very helpful folks who lend their time to help beginners somehow manage to forget to mention these facts.

Too many beginners dive in head first without reading a few basics, IMO. I know because that's what I did. Asking dumb questions is OK. Searching for the answers first is better. Giving wrong answers is to be avoided if possible.

[don_crissti]

Not meaning to be picky...

1) what the root command is for This Distro;

There is no root command, no matter what distro you use. However, certain commands require root privileges. How to become root... well that has been dealt with here:

http://linuxgator.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=238

sarcastic_bastard, vampirefo and others have several posts where they describe additional methods to become root, just search the forums (it is true a howto containing all of them would not hurt...)

2) The basic command to install a program for this
distro; basic one to uninstall etc

What do you mean by that ? Install a rpm or install form source ?

3) How directories are done to reference file locations

I didn't get this one...

4) How to access & use the Synaptic Package Manager, with helpful tips on critical downloads that are available there, like certain graphics drivers etc.

That is already done in the Get Started guide (it's on your desktop)... and many other things are there... If it needs further polish let me know and I will rewrite that.

5) Xserver crashing remedies - given in detail, step by step, so a Newbie can understand it.

That would be a good idea... It is true that related posts are scattered around...

There are also these two threads for those who want additional resources:
http://linuxgator.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=617
http://linuxgator.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=714
remember... reading doesn't hurt...

Other than these, I totally agree with what azziam said : any newcomer should know that getting proficient with Linux requires some efforts on his/her part and although it's in the human nature to look for shortcuts some things (reading & searching) have to be done in order to get familiar with the basics...